 deviL
Postări: 578
De la: Muntenegru
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Ahahaha XEvah  
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"There is a hero in all of us"
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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO WHYYYYYYYY GOOOOOOOOOOOOOODDDDDDDDD WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That ruined all the fun now if you aren't that strong you can never defend to a opponent with money. So now game will be boring since you 'll see you dont have that much money or in a situation2-3v1 you never win so you can leave game and tont even bother cause since other 2 guys have twice your forces you cant tb!!!!!
Damn thats sucks what where you thinking????????
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 scud
Postări: 20
De la: Canada
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I think this makes perfect sense.
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If you fail at failing, you are most certainly winning.
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 Garde
Postări: 2842
De la: Canada
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Renewed opinion: Update is plain crap, no strategy except SM and maybe BZ can play this game properly, as if you own a lot of land first-hand you automatically win.
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Sign the petition to remove it, guys: http://afterwind.com/forum/topic.php?topic_id=3765
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Scris de Mahdi, 23.11.2013 at 20:30
I don't consider the phrase "massive fag" to be an insult. Mods did. 
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 tophat
Postări: 3885
De la: Canada
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I disagree to those saying it will ruin the strategy part of this game because it won't. Players will adapt as the battle mechanics change, that's just how the game works. Although i think this update is a bit too harsh just think of it this way. If a player has a 60 unit stack early in a game it takes 30 units to have a 50% chance of turnblocking it. Is it even worth turnblocking anymore? Also, it's not every moment in a game where someone can sum up 30 units to turnblock a stack let alone the amount of movements it'll take to join them up, by then, the enemies 60 units have already moved. Here's something still within what's been updated but a bit more realistic and reachable;
1-10 units = 1 to turnblock
11-20 units = 3 to turnblock
21-30 units = 5 to turnblock
31-40 units = 7 to turnblock
41-50 units = 9 to turnblock
etc...
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Don't trust the manipulative rabbit.
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tophat
Postări: 3885
De la: Canada
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Also, i don't see why this update was needed. The game is growing with new players not to mention more competitive players. Why go off and make such a drastic change while the game was at its highest peak. There was nothing wrong with the old system.
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Don't trust the manipulative rabbit.
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I agree with TopHats. I this should be based on 10% rather than a whopping 50%. Nevertheless, the situation we had previously where units wouldn't even engage at all was incredibly frustrating.
And I think this update misses out on a big point. With imperialist or GW, you can pump out huge numbers of troops, especially in a world game. Now, another player may not own such a huge chunk of land as you do. But, they may be using a strategy such as Great Combinator which doesn't need them to recruit huge masses of troops to be very powerful. Yet now, if the big player combines all their troops into a single stack, they will be unstoppable, end of. No strategy. Just SPAM.
And if you consider the crazy number of cities one is in possession of in a world game, you will understand the terrible implications of this; that a player cannot organise a defence for the whole of their territory, so they get steamrolled by anyone who has loads of units.
The big point is? That the term "turnblocking" is overused. The problem we were trying to solve was the previous anti-turnblocking solution which often prevented engagements from occuring. This actually worsens the situation, which had more or less been sorted out. We need engagements between legitimate armies. But we need them to happen. And getting steamrolled simply because of someone's starting position--however important it is--is not cool. Back in my day, a skilled player could beat a noob despite being heavily outnumbered--through their sheer genius. No more.
Therefore:
I propose it is changed to 10% as a temporary solution and think of something else in the meantime.
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YOBA:
Youth-Oriented, Bydło-Approved
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People are so used to exploit the turnblock (which wasn't meant to exist) that they totally forgot they can still use good old walls to delay attacks. The only difference now is that you can't do it forever, which was obviously not intended.
There's also the fact that this is a turn-based strategy game, not an arcade. You need to play always thinking in the next moves your opponent does, which means you will actually have to manage defensive troops wisely instead of building a few bombers to turnblock (is that what you call skill? pff...).
It is predictable that all the players who exploit every advantage that this update defeats are the ones complaining.
In my opinion, that demonstrates both the appropriateness and necessity of this update. Well done Amok, and don't listen to a few vocal nay sayers.
Perfect.
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"Whenever death may surprise us, let it be welcome if our battle cry has reached even one receptive ear and another hand reaches out to take up our arms".
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tophat
Postări: 3885
De la: Canada
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I agree with yoba. 10% seems legitimate to me and reasonable.
No worries though, i think players will understand what the criticism portrayed in this update means once they see it on the battle grounds. Spammers, large bomber stacks and auto-producing will be overpowered which in my opinion is easy gameplay.
@Pinheiro. I know you like to be unpredictable and play with cheap countries like Laos, Brunei, Greenland etc. because i do too. I find them fun and a challenge for myself to overcome the larger enemies. But with this update how will that be even possible. All the enemy has to do is send a large stack to your cap and you're done, let alone his income and reinforcement advantages.
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Don't trust the manipulative rabbit.
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It is predictable that all the players who exploit every advantage that this update defeats are the ones complaining.
In my opinion, that demonstrates both the appropriateness and necessity of this update. Well done Amok, and don't listen to a few vocal nay sayers.
I'm sorry, but if I may point out, that is kind of obvious, Guest/Pinheiro. The players who do understand turnblocking and are, therefore, able to use it to their advantage are the ones complaining. It would be the same if a specific strategy was nerfed or if a certain country's income / reinforcement rate was tweaked. But in this case the victim was one of the mechanics that force skillful play in the game.
Another thing that - I'm sure you didn't mean to - can be understood from your post, Guest, is that TB is a cheating device, or an exploit of sorts. Turnblocking was never treated as an exploit by the moderators or developers, so players never knew it was so. It's even explained in a thread in the strategy forums by Hugosch himself. Wallglitching I can understand and - while I agree that I've used it sometimes - it is not a fair mechanic and should, indeed, be removed. I do believe that are other unexplored solutions for this problem, as making enemy units "traversable" removes flowers (something very dear to my heart, as I'm very fond of gardening), makes walling enemy units much more easier. And on top of it all is unrealistic.
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Scris de Mahdi, 23.11.2013 at 20:30
I don't consider the phrase "massive fag" to be an insult. Mods did.
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This is the worst update I have ever seen. I get weakening turnblocking (which I think was overnerfed), but removing completely the ability to make walls with bombers or units that don't fit in defensive lines is horrendous.
People are so used to exploit the turnblock (which wasn't meant to exist) that they totally forgot they can still use good old walls to delay attacks. The only difference now is that you can't do it forever, which was obviously not intended.
There's also the fact that this is a turn-based strategy game, not an arcade. You need to play always thinking in the next moves your opponent does, which means you will actually have to manage defensive troops wisely instead of building a few bombers to turnblock (is that what you call skill? pff...).
It is predictable that all the players who exploit every advantage that this update defeats are the ones complaining.
In my opinion, that demonstrates both the appropriateness and necessity of this update. Well done Amok, and don't listen to a few vocal nay sayers.
Perfect.
I think people don't care as much about being able to move stacks freely as the inability to prevent stacks from moving. There is basically no way to slow a charge now. Sure, you can call it a strategy game. The fact remains that the game is changed now, with the most important decisions changing from "what moves do I make" to "what units do I make." Inevitably, this is going to reduce Afterwind to a RPS-style game, where strategies and counterstrategies will take precedence over actual moves. Instead of "I know that SM's weakness is that they need to spend 2 moves to capture a city," it will be "I can just spam units at him and I know that he can't stop me so he will run out of money going on defense."
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Qui non proficit, deficit. UCR 5/5/11-2/14/12. 6/17/12 -  Coniunctum, sumus invicta.
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Scris de TDFall, 25.04.2012 at 18:20
This is the worst update I have ever seen. I get weakening turnblocking (which I think was overnerfed), but removing completely the ability to make walls with bombers or units that don't fit in defensive lines is horrendous.
can't agree more worst ever!!! i even don't get why you can't make wall with bombers????
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tophat
Postări: 3885
De la: Canada
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I agree with the removal turnblocking, I've played a few game and I see nothing wrong with it. But the the whole through enemy unit thing makes no sense to me.
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Don't trust the manipulative rabbit.
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Gotta agree with TopHats here -- the removal of TB's is great, but the enemy unit thing is dumb. Please check my thread, admins.
http://afterwind.com/forum/topic.php?topic_id=3774
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I was banned for your sins
VAGlJESUS ["I love me some KFC"]
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It's funny because people actually think bombers can effectively defend anything. Nice update, guys. Finally those idiotic Sky Menace twats with their bomber flowers are finished.
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I am prepared to do whatever it takes to win, so long as there is the chance that there is a chance for victory. I will cut my losses when I know I am beaten. I will show mercy to my enemies in honorable combat. I will show none to those who I deem unfit.
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Garde
Postări: 2842
De la: Canada
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Scris de LHAotSF, 25.04.2012 at 22:00
It's funny because people actually think bombers can effectively defend anything. Nice update, guys. Finally those idiotic Sky Menace twats with their bomber flowers are finished.
Nope, only the start of a new age of SM trollings.
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WOOOOOOOT
THANK YOU IVAN
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Hi all,
back after a few months and my first "new" games were interesting : cities turnblocked in first turn with one enemy units....
No problem at all, it's a game and rules are the same for all, just adapt and win .. (semper fi ! uh !  )
I agree with this quoted post :
"This update will be a great improvement. I remember the times where there was no turnblocking at all, and it worked perfectly and was a lot strategy after all. You can still block now, if you have at least 50% of the units. Also it is still able to wall up yourself and your enemy, unlike what is being said here.
I agree it will change the whole current AW system with strategies, but its a good change. The only critisism that you can have iom, is that some strategies might become OP. But we have to check that in practice and we can change it when we notice it is OP.
Just try it, then give your opinion."
And with Learster's one too ... (like before )
Let's give it a try, and see with Amok and Yvan if it needs some tweaking.
Big stacks have allways been hard to counter, we used def wall before to slow them.
Just adapt ... and win ...
That is why AW is a great game : Nothing is written in marble.
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I am not for this. The old way of turn blocking made the game more strategical but now turn blocking is a spam match. Try to picture your enemy from USA bringing a 300 unit stack to your land and you just noticed it. How are you gonna come up with 150 units to tb it so quickly in 1 turn? I prefer the old tb system better because it allowed for more strategical thinking rather than "make big stacks and send them to land." The old system made players think out attacks more and thats what I liked. Also SM is too OP in europe games now. I also hate the new Units allowed to go through bomber walls now too. That right there can be exploited and used to troll players.
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I like stuff.... Yay?
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I am not for this. The old way of turn blocking made the game more strategical but now turn blocking is a spam match. Try to picture your enemy from USA bringing a 300 unit stack to your land and you just noticed it. How are you gonna come up with 150 units to tb it so quickly in 1 turn?
and still you want to tb it? first of all.. Hey now can the USA guy win for once and diddent put all hes units over there to get it tb?! than second thing.. if he surpreced u with hes stack of 300 units, what where u doing u probly diddent pay attation....
and u diddent make wals? u can still fuck hes big stack by making walls around your citys.. yes it takes more time but if u do it right he still cant get your citys if u wall it over and over agian =) just like the old days =)..
soo happy with the update <3 =D!!
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Impossible is a word to be found only in the dictionary of fools.
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I too disagree with this update after playing a few test matches.
It encourages doom stacks that take much of the strategy out of the game, whatever happened to the maxim "March Divided, Fight United"?
As an alternative, why can't turn blocks simply slow the enemy, I would not even care if you just slowed the attacker to 50% of their move (or an amount related to how much you attack with). You could even take out the luck factor.
Or go the other way and give large stacks some of the same penalties in the real world, such as reduced movement speed.
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I hope this is a nice compromise to everyone.
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Great update, i hope this will calmdown all the ragewar that was going on yesterday.
I have a question: Does someone know if the turnblocks are prioritized by order like before or if you have 50% of chance to turnblock a stack of 10 unit with 5 units even if you make this turnblock at your last move?
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WINSGAMESANDSHIT
Cont șters |
WINSGAMESANDSHIT
Cont șters
People are so used to exploit the turnblock (which wasn't meant to exist) that they totally forgot they can still use good old walls to delay attacks. The only difference now is that you can't do it forever, which was obviously not intended.
There's also the fact that this is a turn-based strategy game, not an arcade. You need to play always thinking in the next moves your opponent does, which means you will actually have to manage defensive troops wisely instead of building a few bombers to turnblock (is that what you call skill? pff...).
It is predictable that all the players who exploit every advantage that this update defeats are the ones complaining.
In my opinion, that demonstrates both the appropriateness and necessity of this update. Well done Amok, and don't listen to a few vocal nay sayers.
Perfect.
It's funny that you write this, since you posted this as well:
[...]Perfect.
In my opinion turnblocking is an essential part of the game and many players (not only in this thread) ask to remove it just because they can't handle it.
The only thing that should be considered is a way to avoid the turn blocking in the first turn of the game. After that, it's a totally avoidable tactic.
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Ok, let's please stay on topic and not turn this to personal discussions. Thanks.
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Scris de Guest, 26.04.2012 at 08:31 It's funny that you write this, since you posted this as well:
The situation was different, but anyway, this isn't the first time I've changed my mind about a subject (not only on AW), and I see no problem in admiting when I'm wrong.
I don't know about you, but whenever I enter a discussion, I want to learn from it and take other opinions into account. Trying to "win" a discussion useless in it's own concept, but do as you find better.
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"Whenever death may surprise us, let it be welcome if our battle cry has reached even one receptive ear and another hand reaches out to take up our arms".
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Great update, i hope this will calmdown all the ragewar that was going on yesterday.
I have a question: Does someone know if the turnblocks are prioritized by order like before or if you have 50% of chance to turnblock a stack of 10 unit with 5 units even if you make this turnblock at your last move?
Turns are still prioritized by order. So your last move will just fail to even have that 50% chance of TB.
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Turns are still prioritized by order. So your last move will just fail to even have that 50% chance of TB.
I should've stated this more clearly in the news update. 50% actually means 100% if your move is a higher priority against the enemy's move. 50% is actually your chance before the moves are processed. So with 5 vs 10 you'll get a 100% chance of turn-blocking if your move gets a higher priority and with 3 vs 10 it will be 60%. Hope this makes sense.
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Scris de Amok, 26.04.2012 at 10:24
Turns are still prioritized by order. So your last move will just fail to even have that 50% chance of TB.
I should've stated this more clearly in the news update. 50% actually means 100% if your move is a higher priority against the enemy's move. 50% is actually your chance before the moves are processed. So with 5 vs 10 you'll get a 100% chance of turn-blocking if your move gets a higher priority and with 3 vs 10 it will be 60%. Hope this makes sense.
So if your TB move is higher priority, then your chance of TB is doubled?
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Scris de Leaf, 26.04.2012 at 10:51
So if your TB move is higher priority, then your chance of TB is doubled?
TB can only happen if your move is of higher priority. Then it is decided by the unit count difference.
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•The chance of turn blocking is now determined by the difference in the amount of units between you and your opponent. Chance % = your units count / opponent units count. So, for example, 3 vs 10 will have a 30% chance to turn-block, 5 vs 10 - 50%, and so on. Max chance is fixed at 50%.
So the underlined Part is just crap, in fact i have 100%chance when Using 50+% of the enemys stack amount AND it has a higher priority.
The first Move cant be Turnblocked, because no other Move can have a higher Priority.
Correct?
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•The chance of turn blocking is now determined by the difference in the amount of units between you and your opponent. Chance % = your units count / opponent units count. So, for example, 3 vs 10 will have a 30% chance to turn-block, 5 vs 10 - 50%, and so on. Max chance is fixed at 50%.
So the underlined Part is just crap, in fact i have 100%chance when Using 50+% of the enemys stack amount AND it has a higher priority.
The first Move cant be Turnblocked, because no other Move can have a higher Priority.
Correct?
All correct except the last part. First move could in fact be turn-blocked, because other player's first move may get a higher priority than your first move.
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Amok, is there a way to make units who occupy the same space engage in battle instead of being pushed away (considering old system of non traversable units)?
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Scris de Mahdi, 23.11.2013 at 20:30
I don't consider the phrase "massive fag" to be an insult. Mods did.
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Walking through enemy units feels really dumb.
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I dislike this update. I don't like the bombers not blocking
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11669x3 is what I made your mom.
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Scris de Amok, 26.04.2012 at 10:56
Scris de Leaf, 26.04.2012 at 10:51
So if your TB move is higher priority, then your chance of TB is doubled?
TB can only happen if your move is of higher priority. Then it is decided by the unit count difference.
Yeah, I understood how TB can happen only if your move is of higher priority. But I don't know if it was a typo but here:
Scris de Amok, 26.04.2012 at 10:24
Turns are still prioritized by order. So your last move will just fail to even have that 50% chance of TB.
I should've stated this more clearly in the news update. 50% actually means 100% if your move is a higher priority against the enemy's move. 50% is actually your chance before the moves are processed. So with 5 vs 10 you'll get a 100% chance of turn-blocking if your move gets a higher priority and with 3 vs 10 it will be 60%. Hope this makes sense.
You've written how a 3vs10 will be 60% not 30%..
So I was asking if your TB move is of higher priority, is the percentage of TB happening automatically doubled? Cause that's what you've written there.
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THE ART OF WAR
Cont șters |
Afterwind is too simple of a game without turnblock because theres no deep strategic thinking. If they don't fix it soon, the high ranked people probably gonna quit because it will be boring. "THEY ARE A DISGRACE OF THE ART OF WAR"
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Here is my two cents. First of all, I don't like the idea of enemies just walking over my units or vice versa. I can adjust, but not to the new difference between air and other units, due to the fact that air units can't wall. Suddenly, Air units will not be the stacks of choice for long distance attacks because you can't protect them. Either allow air units to wall or put it back in.
Secondly, I don't have an opinion on the turnblocking. I haven't played with it yet, so I don't know how it will change. Yes, I did like turnblocking, but I do agree this is more realistic. However, I do plan on formulating an opinion when I have time to play the game more.
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Garde
Postări: 2842
De la: Canada
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My Final opinion: I've played a few matches, and lost them all due to SM etc. I have a wide variety of games I could be playing (or could have played in the past two years), but I chose AW because of how fair and balanced everything seemed. Now, i'm not so sure, considering almost nobody but the Mod team and new players wanted this update (Even the new players wouldn't have wanted this if only TB was in the outdated tutorial!). Where did Afterwind's supportive fans opinions go? I mean, out of nowhere this update comes out, without any warning or opinions. So if the Admins feel pissed off that Afterwinds forum community doesn't like this update, it's their fault for not asking what everyone thinks first (Yes, it's their game, but if they want my money, they have to at least let me help decide with everyone else what the communities opinion is on a game-changing update; I'd like my say to have meaning as well as everyone else's, not just the Mods and high-ranks).
So as a closing statement, I will say that I am very saddened by the sudden update and how it's clearly obvious opinion doesn't mean much when it comes to game-making variables in the Afterwind function. Pinheiro told me to wait a few days, so I will continue to wait, but it seems like how the update currently stands is what will be set in stone. If any major changes are to happen with this update and it's drastic enough to change my opinion, you will hear about it, I guarantee. For now though, i'm going to take a break from Afterwind, and hopefully as I said, there will be some changes. Gard out. ( 1 - 2 weeks)
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Lol Guest
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I like stuff.... Yay?
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Garde
Postări: 2842
De la: Canada
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Charming, really.
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Unnecessary.
.. Lol'd nonetheless.
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In a game I realized how important moves order system was. Even as a GW & MoS player this update literally added the time needed to take a patch of small land like the Balkans and hold it. Even from less experienced players. So basicly a team of 2 rank 4 & 5 allies kept me from taking all of the Balkans for 35 turns as a GW Italy. I was unable to kill their units because they kept moving around avoiding my attacks on them pissing me off from what could've been a quick 5-7 turn take over and complete destruction of that force. Though it gave me good SP it was utterly annoying having a stand still for so long. I eventually had to take over the rest of Europe just to spam bombers in the Balkan countries I still had left just to end the resistance. It was crazy, also not to mention I clearly had the advantage in the begining but couldn't catch enemy units while they went around taking my countries. So in a nutshell please change it back to the old "Turn Order" system.
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I like stuff.... Yay?
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Here is my two cents. First of all, I don't like the idea of enemies just walking over my units or vice versa. I can adjust, but not to the new difference between air and other units, due to the fact that air units can't wall. Suddenly, Air units will not be the stacks of choice for long distance attacks because you can't protect them. Either allow air units to wall or put it back in.
Secondly, I don't have an opinion on the turnblocking. I haven't played with it yet, so I don't know how it will change. Yes, I did like turnblocking, but I do agree this is more realistic. However, I do plan on formulating an opinion when I have time to play the game more.
Wait, you mean there's now 1 reason not to spam air? STOP THE PRESSES, THIS MUST BE FIXED!
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Garde
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For those of you that don't like the update: there are plenty of games on the Internet that have more strategy than this (I think even Bejeweled has a lot more, seeing as sine the update my Mom can play this game fine now; yes, that's bad). If you want to really show how much you hate this update, and how much you want it changed, I suggest just finding another game and checking in here every so often to see if it's been cured or not. ^_^
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Gardevoir, your obnoxiousness really baffles me sometimes...just leave for good already or stop whining.
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Scris de Amok, 29.04.2012 at 08:36
Gardevoir, your obnoxiousness really baffles me sometimes...just leave for good already or stop whining.
New sig right here.
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Scris de Amok, 29.04.2012 at 08:36
Gardevoir, your obnoxiousness really baffles me sometimes...just leave for good already or stop whining.
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Ivan
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